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It seems to me that many pilots have been eager  to purchase MSFS without either having the aircraft they normally fly or not waiting for completed models of the aircraft that they do fly. This may be because of the attractions of the new.

I have been wondering how many have been regularly flying the default LM aircraft:

  • Carenado AC11 Commander
  • Alabeo Extra 300s
  • Lockheed C69A, Electra 10A, Constellation
  • Milviz P38-L
  • Lockheed Martin C-130, F16, F22, F35A
  • Maule M7
  • Mooney Acclaim, Bravo
  • Piper Club
  • Robinson R22
  • Sikorsky CH-53E, MH-60, S-70, UH-60

Why the rush to try an expensive and incomplete new simulator?:huh:

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  • Nick Cooper changed the title to going against the MSFS flow

I still have kept XP and P3D but I am using the new kid on the block more now . My only issue with 2020 is every time there is a update , I lose all my graphic settings . :angry::(

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2 hours ago, Richard McDonald Woods said:

Why the rush to try an expensive and incomplete new simulator?:huh:

 

Expensive? I have bought the game pass and play the basic version of MSFS for free. The costs of the game pass are 1 Euro for the first month (18 Aug - 17 Sep) and 4 Euros for the following 2 months each. So this is very cheap. And also without the game pass, the basic version of MSFS is in the same price range as P3d and XP are, but offers more than those 2 sims.

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1 hour ago, Ron Attwood said:

While I agree with you Nick, (I've not got rid of any sims...yet) the more one uses MFS the harder it is to go back to P3D. I was never really one for staring out the window whilst flying, but now...Can't stop!

 

Exactly the same sentiments here. I can't imagine going back to P3d or XP.

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9 minutes ago, BradB said:

I still have kept XP and P3D but I am using the new kid on the block more now . My only issue with 2020 is every time there is a update , I lose all my graphic settings . :angry::(

 

That's interesting. I was afraid of this and have therefore deliberately checked my settings after the install of the 2 patches, but it was all good, the settings had remained the same. 

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21 minutes ago, wolfko said:

 

That's interesting. I was afraid of this and have therefore deliberately checked my settings after the install of the 2 patches, but it was all good, the settings had remained the same. 

After the last large patch , my custom (mostly high and ultra) settings all reverted to low , very odd indeed .

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It is strange, given that your settings and preferences are stored in the upper atmosphere somewhere. In the beginning, for reasons I cannot recall, I had to do a complete reinstall. I braced myself to have to redo all the controls etc. all over again.

But hallelujah! When I fired up the sim ALL the settings were as I left them.

Make no mistake, this was a root and branch reinstall.

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I must admit have thrown XP 11 (and 10) out of the window, bought many Orbx scenery add ons for XP11 in particular, but something about the XP series has never gelled with me, its a lifeless world, very hard to explain, still clunky interface too after all these years ... yes, even MS FS2020 has a dodgy new clunky UI for controllers, but XP ... could never get it right or to my satisfaction with a lot of controllers, dedicated FS controllers. I say that after many years of trying X-Plane, never said a word against it in its beginnings or mid life though.

And fair play to those that still like X-plane, have fun and enjoy ... I'm not shelving it, gave it fair trial, good few years before I even thought about commenting on this :) I un-installed it after a very long period of usage.

My advice is for the day one folk who like to announce they want to go against MS 2020 flow or put it on the shelf as one guy recently said ... though how your are going to see it evolve into a better sim on the shelf is quite beyond me?  My advice is don't even mention it? why do you do this, what do you hope to achieve in saying such things? Why announce you hate a new project without the wisdom and experience of seeing it evolve is quite beyond me???

Come back in a year and say that, but just now, it means nothing, surely? Otherwise its just the usual same old same old we got with FS9 haters voicing on FSX, the FSX haters voicing on P3D, P3D 4.5 haters voicing on P3D V5 folk and so on and so forth ... futile projection ... no software ever gets released perfect .. is that an ideal situation ... no, but its how it is ... My mantra for what its worth is ... lets enjoy even a less than perfect sim while we can, let the devs know if there is something we dont like and do it constructively, the FS2020 boards are open to all owners now ... moaning on a forum who only produce "scenery" for a new Sim platform does not help, it just causes angst and division.

At the end of the day, elderly member here who is in danger group of contracting the horrible Corona thing doing the rounds, my days left are not as many as many younger healthier members here, we should appreciate what we have for any given time ... you never know what is around the corner, Corona or not ... these are good FS times we live in, we should appreciate it if we can.

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6 hours ago, Ron Attwood said:

It is strange, given that your settings and preferences are stored in the upper atmosphere somewhere. In the beginning, for reasons I cannot recall, I had to do a complete reinstall. I braced myself to have to redo all the controls etc. all over again.

But hallelujah! When I fired up the sim ALL the settings were as I left them.

Make no mistake, this was a root and branch reinstall.



Ron Attwood, precisely, when the new FS2020 patch came out, for some reason patch got confused and made me download the whole lot again, took a deep breath and made a cup of tea and did something else, never moaned on any online forum :) my only fear was my careful multi controller settings would be lost, but all was there when download finished, even my global settings ... where they kept in cloud? maybe, my flight hours were.

Apart from loss of controller sensitivity option that a hot fix should fix ASAP IMHO, its a good 2nd patch.

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8 hours ago, BradB said:

After the last large patch , my custom (mostly high and ultra) settings all reverted to low , very odd indeed .

 

Thats a quick fix though BradB and as many big patches for many different sims introduce new graphical fixes, we really should consider a fresh start for graphic settings with each new pig patch, its quick to do, fine tuned controller settings take longer, they stayed with me with this patch but we lost the sensitivity setting, it will be fixed soon though I'm sure :)

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18 minutes ago, B12 said:

 

Thats a quick fix though BradB and as many big patches for many different sims introduce new graphical fixes, we really should consider a fresh start for graphic settings with each new pig patch, its quick to do, fine tuned controller settings take longer, they stayed with me with this patch but we lost the sensitivity setting, it will be fixed soon though I'm sure :)

Yep , it was no big deal ; I’m still fine tuning my settings anyway . Thanks for your input mate . :):)

 

John

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I'm really enjoying MSFS so far, despite the bugs and improvements that need to be made. I planned to uninstall P3D 4.5, but haven't bothered yet - I decided to keep it for A/B comparison  + reality checking some light scenery dev. XP11 is still pretty stable for VR ( unlike P3D which requires running 3-4 apps just to get VR to work ) so I don't plan to uninstall that anytime soon, either ( also plan to go in and compare / feedback / sensitivities flight models since I have a bunch of the same planes for all 3 now )

My main hope for MSFS is that they'll get enough built in systems working ( traffic, weather, base scenery, mp, etc ) working that:


A. we won't have to buy and run multiple apps at the same time to achieve what the sim "should be" and destabilize the sim and:


B. everything will work together in multiplayer, so there will be less of the "have and have nots". I hated flying online and knowing other players are not seeing the same scenery, weather, traffic etc.

I've been running photoscenery and then TE since it was available, and I'm glad that everyone in MSFS is now getting the same amazing experience that the rest of us have been getting for years, minus the $$$ investment and TBs of HD space ;)

 

Also glad that Orbx and the other developers are quickly filling in the weak links of the sim with custom landmark and airport scenery!

Cheers!

Edited by ravenn22
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I am going to give my opinion on MSFS2020.........besides the graphics being very good, its absolute rubbish. It has been desighned for the X-Box and youngsters. This is not Flight simulation but a game for the shoot em up generation. The worst £114.00 I have ever spent. I will not be buying any addons whatsoever. Now I know why this MSFS2020 would not work on Windows 7 ( the best Operating system from Microsoft ever ) because it is APP based. I neeeeeeed the X-Box APP, the X-Box companion APP and the Microsoft store APP to do anything with this. Windows 7 had nothing to do with @88^%&$ APP's that is why this would not work. Even the update has done nothing to address the interface. Before the update I had no problems whatsoever while running this GAME. My PC can handle anything I throw at it and even more now that I built a new system......but I can assure everyone it was not built fo MSFS2020, my old PC handled that with ease. MSFS2020 is Mickey Mouse and a lot has to be done to rectify it. Another thing.....APP's were desighned to spy on us....period. Rant over, i'm off.:banghead::banghead:

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5 minutes ago, appie said:

I am going to give my opinion on MSFS2020.........besides the graphics being very good, its absolute rubbish. It has been desighned for the X-Box and youngsters. This is not Flight simulation but a game for the shoot em up generation. The worst £114.00 I have ever spent. I will not be buying any addons whatsoever. Now I know why this MSFS2020 would not work on Windows 7 ( the best Operating system from Microsoft ever ) because it is APP based. I neeeeeeed the X-Box APP, the X-Box companion APP and the Microsoft store APP to do anything with this. Windows 7 had nothing to do with @88^%&$ APP's that is why this would not work. Even the update has done nothing to address the interface. Before the update I had no problems whatsoever while running this GAME. My PC can handle anything I throw at it and even more now that I built a new system......but I can assure everyone it was not built fo MSFS2020, my old PC handled that with ease. MSFS2020 is Mickey Mouse and a lot has to be done to rectify it. Another thing.....APP's were desighned to spy on us....period. Rant over, i'm off.:banghead::banghead:

 

I didn't know that I'm a youngster. Thank you, you made my day!:D

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10 hours ago, appie said:

I am going to give my opinion on MSFS2020.........besides the graphics being very good, its absolute rubbish. It has been desighned for the X-Box and youngsters. This is not Flight simulation but a game for the shoot em up generation. The worst £114.00 I have ever spent. I will not be buying any addons whatsoever. Now I know why this MSFS2020 would not work on Windows 7 ( the best Operating system from Microsoft ever ) because it is APP based. I neeeeeeed the X-Box APP, the X-Box companion APP and the Microsoft store APP to do anything with this. Windows 7 had nothing to do with @88^%&$ APP's that is why this would not work. Even the update has done nothing to address the interface. Before the update I had no problems whatsoever while running this GAME. My PC can handle anything I throw at it and even more now that I built a new system......but I can assure everyone it was not built fo MSFS2020, my old PC handled that with ease. MSFS2020 is Mickey Mouse and a lot has to be done to rectify it. Another thing.....APP's were desighned to spy on us....period. Rant over, i'm off.:banghead::banghead:

Microsoft didn't reach it's level of solvency by doing too many dumb things - I remember a couple :).

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22 hours ago, B12 said:

Apart from loss of controller sensitivity option that a hot fix should fix ASAP IMHO, its a good 2nd patch.

The good part is that the sensitivity settings you had before the latest patch are retained and work as before. I made what I thought was the mistake after the 2nd patch of deleting a preset. Fortunately before I did it I copied it to make changes. It was only when I had copied and deleted I found the sensitivity option had been squashed. After a mild falm palming exercise I exited and restarted and happiness was returned.

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11 hours ago, appie said:

I am going to give my opinion on MSFS2020.........besides the graphics being very good, its absolute rubbish. It has been desighned for the X-Box and youngsters. This is not Flight simulation but a game for the shoot em up generation. The worst £114.00 I have ever spent. I will not be buying any addons whatsoever. Now I know why this MSFS2020 would not work on Windows 7 ( the best Operating system from Microsoft ever ) because it is APP based. I neeeeeeed the X-Box APP, the X-Box companion APP and the Microsoft store APP to do anything with this. Windows 7 had nothing to do with @88^%&$ APP's that is why this would not work. Even the update has done nothing to address the interface. Before the update I had no problems whatsoever while running this GAME. My PC can handle anything I throw at it and even more now that I built a new system......but I can assure everyone it was not built fo MSFS2020, my old PC handled that with ease. MSFS2020 is Mickey Mouse and a lot has to be done to rectify it. Another thing.....APP's were desighned to spy on us....period. Rant over, i'm off.:banghead::banghead:

Don't let the door hit you on the way out. ;):ph34r:

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I'm not flightsimming at the moment (real aircraft photography has my attention now) but I decided to stay with P3D 4.5 for a while, at least until winter.

I gave up on P3D v5.0. Not for the sim itself, it will mature in time, but not all add-ons (even Orbx) work as advertised.

As for MSFS; too many bug reports are posted everywhere on the internet to hold me off at the moment.

I don't mind people saying it's a game. I'm a low and slow eye candy scenery lover anyway. :)

So eventually I will take the step.

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20 hours ago, appie said:

its absolute rubbish

With great respect, this is nonsense. The default sim is in a different league to all those that came before. As has been said you can try the sim for very little on game pass. I just can't see why you wouldn't enjoy the VFR experience, whilst waiting for the other IFR things to be put right, which no doubt they will be. 

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This thread exists as clickbait and demands to be trolled. And it won't age well (even worse than P3D and XP11.5).

 

I paid an inexpensive $60 for it, and it's a bargain as I get all the weather and terrain I'll ever want for free with that along with free updates that will include VR, seasons, and helicopters in the first six months alone. I'll will bite my tongue on the rest of what I have to say since it obvious to anyone who has been enjoying what is clearly the best simulator of any type in the history of the known universe. 

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On 9/18/2020 at 11:40 AM, wain71 said:

Crash helmet on........

 

I have uninstalled MSFS for the moment.....I did have access to the BETA for just over a month before it went on sale so I have been using it for a while, I wanted to sort my controls out and get it going to my liking. However aside from some of the stunning screenshots, especially the damp / wet apron, the lighting and obviously some great visuals of the planet, I find at this moment it just isn't for me. It just seems to be all about the looks at the moment though I feel they will get there in the end. I do a lot of testing for Just Flight in the other sims and just want a solid sim running well with planes I like and MSFS for me is not it. I have gone back to XP and P3D as I like how I have them at the moment, though I am still not fully committed to v5 yet....I also recently removed AFS2, again that's not for me....

 

So I will sit back and admire all your MSFS screenshots and maybe if I decide to buy my new PC next year I may try again. This is no criticism of anyone using it at all.....

 

Pressing SUBMIT now......lol

 

Wayne

I'm with you...with the latest patch, to 'boost' performance...(what a laugh in how they did it...sneaky...) they dumbed down LOD for Trees, ground texture, and A.I buildings.  They didn't optimize the code...they removed LOD range in the sliders...WITHIN the code.   I call MSFS now,  FSX-Plus.  I'm shelving it too, for a few months...to see what other wonderful and forced-upon-you patches does to the original RTM coding.  Going back to P3D v5.  With this patch, they have guaranteed the life expectancy of P3D v5.  Absolutely.....  The water now looks like XP11...disgusting, and makes P3D's  nVidia WaterWorks...looks like ten years ahead of what now is seen in post patch MSFS. With what they did to the LOD's in this patch...they also lost a sale of an Xbox X console.  I ain't buying one, to now fly the present version of MSFS.   Nope.

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37 minutes ago, Orbx Flyer said:

they removed LOD range in the sliders

 

This aspect of the patch is disappointing, I agree. I'm all for giving people the option to adjust game settings to enable the best performance based on individual hardware, as opposed to a blanket wholesale change like this. I'm hopeful once they integrate DX12 along with continued updates the game will be in a better place down the road. That being said, I'm certainly quite enjoying it. The core game, sprinkled with quality products from Orbx and their partners makes for an enjoyable experience, warts and all.

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Actually, the missing detail after the 2nd MSFS 2020 update is really obvious in vegetation.  See below for pics of OG20 before the MSFS 2020 1.8.3.0 update and after the update.  The 1.8.3.0 update stripped vegetation as demonstrated by the comparison of the before and after pics at OG20 and, as far as I can tell, everywhere around the world.   I hope it is a mistake.....

 

Before update:

OG20%20Before%202nd%20Update.jpg?dl=0 

 

After update:

OG20%20After%202nd%20Update.jpg?dl=0

 

Rod

 

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2 hours ago, stiletto2 said:

Actually, the missing detail after the 2nd MSFS 2020 update is really obvious in vegetation.  See below for pics of OG20 before the MSFS 2020 1.8.3.0 update and after the update.  The 1.8.3.0 update stripped vegetation as demonstrated by the comparison of the before and after pics at OG20 and, as far as I can tell, everywhere around the world.   I hope it is a mistake.....

 

Before update:

OG20%20Before%202nd%20Update.jpg?dl=0 

 

After update:

OG20%20After%202nd%20Update.jpg?dl=0

 

Rod

 

It's not a mistake, Rod...it's what this patch was intended to do, amongst other things....

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Many users complaint there were too many trees and bushes adjacent to airports, in fact that there are generally too many trees in MSFS.

And who can say which of the 2 images @stiletto2 had posted corresponds better with the real world?

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This is becoming ugly. I was doing a VFR flight from the new Wycombe to Bristol two days ago and was absolutely pleased with what I saw. Plus, performance was great with > 40 fps and no stutters (okay, that's not a diffficult region).

 

Yesterday, after learning the patch has downgraded scenery, I started to count trees and watching out for missing features. Argh. :angry:

 

Kind regards, Michael

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1 hour ago, pmb said:

Yesterday, after learning the patch has downgraded scenery, I started to count trees and watching out for missing features. Argh. :angry:

 

Ignorance is bliss! :lol:

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I bought the deluxe premium version as it was just the half cost of P3D professional version ( I hate any text on my screen and videos) and besides was their best version

I feel satisfied with it so far. I have 100 mb internet so I think that helps a lot in the performance, but there are just a few things I don't like:

 

01.-  The default angle of the external view, top of the plane and backwards. I prefer the angel and distance P3D has in the external view 100%. I manged to set my own keys to go around the plane 360 on the external view but the change of angle is not smooth is done too fast not like in P3D which I prefer. I haven't been able to improve that

 

02.- That some cities don't really look like the real ones, they have lots of default autogen. Despite they look nice I expected something better. I do know and understand this stuff of the imagery. It is just the expectation what is hurt here. I tried to do my capital and couldn't find any photogrammetry. I found some 3D buildings modeled though but I'm learning how to include them.

 

03.- Sometimes depending on the lighting the building facades are difficult to distinguish I prefer the clear look of the objects in P3D

 

04.- I don't like the sound of the big planes. I need to hear and feel the vibration of all PMDG's planes so this will always bring me back to P3D.

 

But in general it is a good sim, after flying a while if you go back to the same place in P3D (not an Orbx site of course) you can simply not avoid smiling and feeling it kind of cartoonish. I now feel the planes in P3D fly too slow. Or is it that they fly too fast in MSFS? :wacko:

 

I like P3D v4.5 and have invested so much in that one that I feel strange to have put it aside so often and for so long but to be honest this sim would have died long ago if it wasn't for Orbx and some other developers.

 

I mean MSFS is great by itself compared to the default P3D, what makes P3D great is Orbx.

 

Every Orbx product created for P3D is so enjoyable that keeps you coming back to P3D but they are starting to create/port for MSFS which will make it even better.

 

If we get MSFS as full of Orbx products as in P3D, in time, we'll reach a no point of comparison between both

 

There are a lot of people also creating/improving the sim so this won't stop from getting better and better. In my opinion P3D must come with an outstanding improvement to keep them alive and of course with the help of Orbx.

 

But I afraid I am using more MSFS (than I expected) than P3D

 

Cheers

Carlos

 

 

 

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On 9/20/2020 at 7:26 AM, flying_fish said:

With great respect, this is nonsense. The default sim is in a different league to all those that came before. As has been said you can try the sim for very little on game pass. I just can't see why you wouldn't enjoy the VFR experience, whilst waiting for the other IFR things to be put right, which no doubt they will be. 

I think he was injecting,  reverse-humor. Nothing else...and his post made me smile.

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On 9/21/2020 at 12:44 PM, carlosqr said:

 

01.-  The default angle of the external view, top of the plane and backwards. I prefer the angel and distance P3D has in the external view 100%. I manged to set my own keys to go around the plane 360 on the external view but the change of angle is not smooth is done too fast not like in P3D which I prefer. I haven't been able to improve that

 

 

 

 

I suggest to use the drone mode for externatl view. This is much smoother and gives you many more options.

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1 hour ago, wolfko said:

 

I suggest to use the drone mode for externatl view. This is much smoother and gives you many more options.

Hi Wolfgan

Yeap I do use it too

Thanks

Carlos

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Hi All,

 

          Please have an opinion, although do not assume it is ok to go back down the path of Sim bashing. That is how topics are Locked or Removed. And unnecessary comments because you do not agree with a users opinion will not be tolerated. Please keep the discussion civil.

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I think over time many will end up where several over the testers are.

Having been using msfs since Alpha i now simply cant fly it.

It just has far to many issues for me ranging far and wide from weather depiction to scenery back to flight model.

Many of the issues where identified back in February and have not been addressed.

To top it off the lack of good aircraft puts the final nail it its coffin, however im getting amazing performance now in V5 with aircraft that had until the last 12 months been taxing on system resources.

Now i have beautiful payware airports that are all paid for, beautiful aircraft that perform brilliantly in a sim with a far better flight model with weather i can define properly and storms that look like storms not mobile erupting volcano's.

99.8% of msfs airports look no better than xplanes freeware ones and im generally flying from my large collection of payware airports which all are better than the best MSFS airports.

The world in MSFS can look great from time to time but go flying in Alaska it looks worse than P3D or xplanes as it uses terrible texturing and a mesh model that is worse than either of the other two.

Lighting is the one area in which MSFS excels however with P3DV5 now on DX12 lighting superior to that in MSFS is a possibility in V5 in the not to distant future.

But at the end of the day the aircraft are the difference and with no SDK, still murmours about MS and Asobo not letting devs into the core of the sim will mean it could be well after V5 gets a lighting upgrade that we see the first of a huge number of aircraft already working beautifully in V5.

So why should i go and rebuy a whole bunch of stuff i already have working extremely well in a sim with better aircraft, a far superior flight model, weather that is in many cases better looking(sometimes not) and may soon have a lighting model that will at least provide a viable option to msfs's lovely lighting?

So im not buying anything for msfs until the Dev ie  Asobo and MS get there act together.

We where telling them of issues like how do i set the visibility to 800m, the A320 flight model back in February and they have done nothing to act on any of that.

To me its been quite disrespectful to those who wasted their time and real world experience telling them about issues they have continually failed to act upon art any level for over 6 months.

On the oter hand my P3D experience has never been better in the Labs and Pmdg fleet.

Why change whats not only not broken but is completely superior as a simulation??

 

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