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John Venema

announcement Effective immediately - restrictions on downloads of FSS transferred licenses

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9 hours ago, addman said:

Please ignore this. I have no idea what's wrong or why it's here.....anyway here's the question....

 

...is it possible to patch FTXC3 so that it would only allow downloading of uninstalled products? If so, that might be of benefit both to ORBX and to those who have a legitimate need to get the files when needed for a reinstall. Just a thought.....

 

Doug

Edited by Triplane

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9 hours ago, John Venema said:

 

Deal with it Bert, you're a big boy. A dutchman calling another dutchman arrogant, that's priceless :lol:

 

Why are you even posting in this topic?  Do you have anything constructive to add or are you trolling?

And I thought all along I was dealing with an Australian.  It is obvious I was wrong though.  I still have a system that will not work ....unanswered support request and no backup downloads as deleted for space reasons as told by you they will not work.  

Big boy....treat us with respect........

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My issue is not with the policy (as it did not effect me) but the tone in which you address your customers.  Condescending them when you weren't prepared and assuming they'll ALWAYS buy your products is arrogant.  We help put food on your table, a little respect would be nice.  Especially considering the high prices of your products.  And the thought of paying extra for download speeds that should come at sticker price?  (Gulp)

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3 hours ago, Nick Cooper said:

RJ, yes I am well aware that users may well find numerous ways to damage their installations, I have been known to do it myself.

It has to be assumed that the installation contains FTX products only, as the guide is for re-installing FTX products only.

There is no one search term that catches all the FTX files added by all the FTX installers.

 

 

Nick

 

Assuming that the installation only contains Orbx products is simply not a realistic expectation. Most users are going to have other vendor's products installed. It is my understanding that the only files changed in the scenery /world/scenery folder is the AEC elevation corrections and Global. I suggest that it would be safer not to copy the scenery/world/scenery folder but to install Global and then run the AEC tool once you have your simulator back where you want it. If I am wrong and the Scenery/world/scenery folder contains other file than Global and AEC corrections please let me know.  

 

Greg

Edited by gregmorin
typo

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3 hours ago, KVSandleben said:

 

Obviously there is nothing ridiculous about it when you suddenly face 50TB of traffic.

If I hadn't recently had to set up my whole OS from scratch, I wouldn't have the need to download a single bit from ORBX, because I had all of my purchases installed in my sim.

Just because they switch to a new distribution system, doesn't mean that you have to re-download all your stuff again.

Apparently you have not read all my posts before quoting me. I did have to download all my purchases again as my licenses had all been transferred to Orbx making all my existing archives useless. Then my OS was reinstalled fresh, i.e. no registry keys to handle existing FSS wrapper installs. That left me with no option but to download all new products. If i had understood that my wrappers would have been useless, I would have proceeded differently. Because I was not a member of the forum prior to making the switch to Orbx direct, I didnt make that connection that my old archives would be useless. Mind you, that is a very big change and one that should have come with a better warning that the old wrappers would be made completely obsolete. Management of change procedures were not well implemented here.

 

If I had not been able to get all the downloads done when I did, and were forced to peacemeal the installation back one day at a time for over a month, I certainly would deem it rediculous given that I entered into a legal agreement with certain access rights to my products only to have those access rights unilaterally changed without notice or reasonable remedy before the fact. This is no trivial matter, and this will certainly impact the trust that people have in Orbx's ability to deliver in the future.

 

I am not unsympathetic to Orbx's plight on bandwidth costs being a business owner myself. However I would not dream in a million years of treating my customers with such little regard as shown here today by Orbx when this situation was born out of their own doing.

 

And for all those here that dont think this is a big deal, your legal rights are being violated by restricting access to product you have paid for. I am not advocating that everyone start legal proceedings. I like Orbx's product offering and I want to see them succeed so they continue to create and provide a high quality products. To that end I have tried to offer information and suggestions for resolution, but it should be very clear that Orbx has a large onus upon them to remedy their mistake, and quickly.

 

While this does not currently impact me now immediately,  it doesnt mean that I will trust Orbx in the future to not make similar decisions that could impact agreements that I have entered into in good faith. Once bitten twice shy.

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don't talk down to me mate.  YOU are the one who suddenly changed everything and made it impossible to access orbx except through your central v3.  YOU are the one who should have prepared for the expected effects.  OF COURSE everyone is going to panic.  for instance if we were, as i was, halfway through upgrading Global to a new PC build, why should WE be the ones who have to read your damn small print, we've got enough problems of our own -- caused by your deciding to change your whole system.

 

YOU should be apologizing to ME.  don't you dare blame ME for YOUR stupidity in not being prepared for the consequences of your actions -- they are after all your actions not mine.  Jeezus Christ:  first trump and now you.  i'm fed up with the lot of you.  i walked away from the first.  i'll keep walking if you trash me in any more postings.

 

love and kisses

 

tom bestor

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Have not migrated yet since my setup is working just fine and have no need to add more scenery at the moment (waiting for Germany South & Tropical Airports)

so I can't comment on the Temp Restriction. But I agree this was not handled appropriately. (PR?)

 

The suggestion to program Central 3 to read the older wrappers seems good.

 

I do not agree to a Premium Account for "downloads" since we had that functionality for Free (or included in the price) from FSS and

believe this problem is only temporary, so no future use of a Premium Account.

 

1 hour ago, Stewart Hobson said:

@Trevor Bagnell I'm sure you realize that what you've paid for is not the product itself, but the license that allows you to use the product.

Stew. IMO, In this case the Licenses are the Products.

Edited by ramonb

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Love ORBX, but please let us use our activation licenses we have already until it is smoothed out.

 

I am a disabled veteran on a tight budget, and flight-simming and add ons are  something that I have to sacrifice other things for, and is the only hobby that I can actually spend money on.

 

To buy a single scenery or aircraft I have to cut something from the budget (Want to get LOWI when it comes out, drink only sweet tea that I amke for a month no soda drinks to have the extra funds, want a scenery and a new aircraft, drink water for a month, no sweet tea, etc...)

 

So, please do not charge me a premium membership to download products that I had to sacrifice for to purchase.

 

There are senior discounts worldwide because seniors are on a limited budget, and that is great.

 

But for a young person disabled through an accident, and even though they are on a limited budget, most times less than a senior makes because their career was cut short by the accident, there are no discounts for them.

 

So, making less and having no recourse to earn more, they have to sacrifice much for lifes simple pleasures that so many don't even think twice about.

 

Why sim if it is a sacrifice to do so I have been asked many times, maybe you shouldn't buy add ons if you can't afford it, etc...

 

Why should a disabled person be expected to have no life, no joy, no hobbies, nothing but a bare existence?

 

The m$30 would be something else I would have to sacrifice.

 

I cannot spend even $30 without having to adjust my budget quite a bit.

 

So once again, please, please, do not charge me a premium subscription to enjoy your products.

 

 

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For most folks my age, they are earning a respectable income by now, or if they are living paycheck to paycheck they can go out and get a night job, or do landscaping on the side, etc...

 

I was disabled in the Army, I have a set amount each month and no more, and the privileged of owning a car, and living under a roof and the insurance, and eating budget generic brand foods takes 90% of my monthly check, there is no extra hobby or walking around money, there is barely enough just to exist.

 

My computer, and flightsim and add ons were only through time and sacrificing certain food and drinks for.

 

I don't eat out, I don't get to go to movies, I don't go to vacations, and I sacrifice deserts, ice cream, drinks, etc, to afford an add on, because my flight simulator brings me hours of joy and happiness.

 

Imagine having around $150 a month to eat on, period.

 

If I want an ORBX scenery, the Walmart version of soda pops are out for a month, no ice cream, no chips, no vegi's, just cheap frozen meals or peanut butter and bologna sandwiches for a month.

 

So folks, please before you call for a blanket premium subscription across the board, please think or those of us who by age, or injuries, or on limited incomes.

 

Thank you.

 

And I am not exaggerating on the food quality I live on, it costs a lot to eat a healthy diet, I cannot afford meats, fresh produce, and fruit, even if I had no computer period.

 

I do not even earn enough to have to pay federal income taxes on my income, yes, past a certain dollar amount the disabled are required to pay taxes on their disability, but I am below that point, I am in the poverty bracket, so yes, simming is a huge sacrifice for me.

Edited by caaront
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Caaront, I would like to know the same question, I have all my downloads and updates of only small products of Orbx saved on an external hard drive because of my limited monthly download service and nearly always buy my larger Orbx products via Digital Media Service offered by the FSS, so IF at any time I need to reinstall am I going to be able to use them? cause there's no-way I'm able to download a 2,4 or 6gig product, I'd have no internet for a month, is the Digital Media Service still gonna be useable? 

 

Regards Rod. 

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16 hours ago, Gent said:

John

 

Why can't you put the wrapper recognition and validation system into Central 3 so it could install from the wrapped file that everyone has? That would take FSS servers out of the picture and also prevent the re download problem. I am one of your few that is moving to a new PC. Another way would be to have Central 3 convert all the FSS wrapper files into Central 3 backup files. That seems like an easy process to me? What am I missing.

 

Thanks

Terry

 I love this Idea!!!!!!!!!!!   I have it all backed up and would rather not need to re download when the time comes to rebuild.

Edited by RHaas
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5 hours ago, gregmorin said:

Nick

 

Assuming that the installation only contains Orbx products is simply not a realistic expectation. Most users are going to have other vendor's products installed. It is my understanding that the only files changed in the scenery /world/scenery folder is the AEC elevation corrections and Global. I suggest that it would be safer not to copy the scenery/world/scenery folder but to install Global and then run the AEC tool once you have your simulator back where you want it. If I am wrong and the Scenery/world/scenery folder contains other file than Global and AEC corrections please let me know.  

 

Greg

 

You are indeed wrong which is why I can only suggest backing up the whole folder.

The folder contains necessary files from regions, airports and AI traffic and none at all

from Vector or Global.

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13 hours ago, John Venema said:

 

Or how about "Hey customers, we're opening our own store and it's the only way you can buy our new stuff. You can leave your old stuff at the old store as long as you want and the old installers will still work".

 

Then, "Oh you transferred your licenses to our new store, cool, thanks!   What --- you are now downloading ALL your products again from the new store? Shit! That's bad, it's going to cost us $2million if everyone does it, money we don't have. Time to hit the STOP button on those downloads and think of a solution"

 

So you're not ready to open new store?...

 

Regards.

Hakan

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Just a thought. I have most of the products from ORBX. I did not transfer my licenses. But I installed FSX C3. All my products are shown in the central but when I want to get them updatet I get a mesage that I'm currently not allowed to do it because of missing License-tramnsfer. And that is OK for me and not the point here. But could You not avoid the big download volume by just validate all installed products that FSX C3 found and marke them as downloads from FSX-Direct. I guess a lot of people download the files because the could not update ther files for England as an example. When all my files from FSS in FSX C3 are exceptet as being from FSX-Direct there is only demand in the future to re-download them, now there is a need when a update is done.

 

Just a thought.

 

Helmut

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Hello Scott,

the answer is that if you have not amended your Windows registry, and you have

backed up copies of the FSS installers, they will continue to work, for re-installing

only, even when there is no more link to the FSS.

 

 

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7 hours ago, w6kd said:

Seems a very inefficient design, from the onset, to require a redownload of all of the data to have a backup file. 

 

 

It does NOT! It seems you still haven't read all the instructions and explanations provided by Orbx, neither you have read this topic carefully.

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unfortunately I do not have many of my products on the external hard drive, but will be nice to install them in bulk if need be.

 

I love FTX 3, and was downloading them slowly, so no biggie, but this talk of subscriptions is scaring me, I will not be able to afford it.

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14 hours ago, John Venema said:

 

I admit it. I messed up. I should have kept the old FSS installers active. My bad, shit happens.

 

We're trying to fix my mistake, hopefully we can have a solution soon that is beginning to look like:

 

A. Allow your old FSS installers to be activated online as they used to be before licenses were transferred

B. Transferring your FSS licenses to OrbxDirect does not impact your old installers

C. Charge an annual A$30 fee for an all-you-can-eat unlimited download OrbxDirect account

 

Now, I think you're on the right path with this, especially items 1 and 2.  I would maybe or maybe not use No. 3.   I'm not a power user like a lot of these people, but frankly, I've always preferred the original method with FSS rather than the automatic method.  I like to know what is being downloaded/installed and where and when.  I normally download on my internet computer and then transfer to the sim computer.  That has two advantages for me....(1)I have an instant archive on the internet computer and (2) I don't have to have my sim computer tied to the internet any more than absolutely necessary.

 

Jeff Smith

#FSS0524487

 

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44 minutes ago, Giancarlo Ferreri said:

Dear John, welcome to the amazing world of the e-commerce.

This was your business choice, you can not blame your customers now if they act unpredictably.

 

2 minutes ago, qf777 said:

This is orbx fault not ours !

 

i bet this gets deleated

 

 

 

 

Folks,

 

JV has already admitted his mistake.

 

The other side of the story is that this situation resembles a - completely unintended -  "DoS attack by downloads". Something has to be done about it and you are kindly invited to suggest what should be done from your POV.   :)

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15 hours ago, John Venema said:

 

.....Time to hit the STOP button on those downloads and think of a solution"

Good advice to yourself, John.   Fully understand this unforeseen budgetary pressure, and the concerns of customers (like me) who have invested hundreds of $/£ in Orbx software and who are worried that the installers will disappear from FSS. 

When I was given the install option in FTXC3 to download through OD or point the browser to a backup file I though to myself, no lets get the most updated version as my backups consist of the original plus a number of patches. hence I have added to your problem. I have only downloaded those I need now, having got maybe 1MB/s rate despite having a 70MB/s broadband at home.

You need to slow us down, not cap us by default, maybe?

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Good morning.

 

I think there's still some confusion over what has actually been restricted, and this is causing some angst when in fact it's mainly business as usual.

 

So let me clarify and perhaps summarise this topic and we can move on.

 

1. The only thing that has been limited to one (1) download per day is the manual download function:

 

5fOPFxo.png

 

2. You can still install as much products as you like through FTX Central 3 - no limits, no caps - that has not changed

 

3. You can backup/restore/move your entire Orbx products in one swift action by copying just two folders from your sim. Nick Cooper explains this in his pinned topic here:

4. If you have not re-installed Windows or moved to a new PC, you can still use all your backed FSS unwrapper installers again if you used them once before. All the registration information is stored in your Windows registry so you won't be prompted for them a second time.

 

5. If you are rebuilding a PC, doing a new install, or moving to P3D - anything that requires the installation of all your Orbx products - please just go ahead and do it. It has been working as normal this entire time, if you used FTX Central V3 to do the installations.

 

6. If you are experiencing slow downloads via FTX Central 3 please bear with us. This is something we are continually trying to solve, made more difficult because it only affects a certain percentage of customers. Most people get near their ISP's maximum speed when downloading (I do, most of the Orbx team does, most of the customer beta testers did), but clearly there are a group of customers who are getting poor download speeds. For this we apologise and I can promise you we are still working with our hosting provider to find solutions.

 

 

Can I just say how taken aback I am at the ferocity of some of the posts in this topic, it's very disappointing. Most people seemed to have posted without even trying to install a product using FTX Central but chose instead to inflame the situation. 

 

We are simply trying to do our best and provide the best online store for you all. Don't be too quick to cry foul when in fact we have only capped a single function of the entire OrbxDirect system to one per day. Everything else works as it should.

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